Sounds like a bold statement, but I believe it to be true. For those of you that don’t know, the view where the saints of God will be gathered together in the air to meet the Lord before the seven year reign of Antichrist, and the Great Tribulation, is often referred to as ‘The Rapture’.
It is not my intention to get into the history behind this view, nor to go into any great detail about it. Rather, I’m just going to do what the post title says; give one verse that I came across when I studied this issue a few years ago, that I believe totally shatters the unbiblical concept of a pre-tribulation rapture of the saints.
The verse?
“Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition.” 2 Thes 2:3
Allow me to clarify. In the above verse, I have highlighted the words, “…that day shall not come…” because here our attention is directed to a particular day. But what is this day?
Well thankfully the prior verses tell us clearly,
“v1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, v2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.”
Here we see that Paul is speaking of the return of our Lord Jesus Christ. Infact, there are other references in the Bible that refer to the Second Advent as “that day” (Matt 24:36, 1 Thes 5:4), however, even without them it is clear that there is only one day in mind in this passage.
Now I am well aware of how those that hold the view of the pre-trib rapture, believe there will be two second comings. The first will gather together the saints and take them to Heaven, the second will usher in the beginning of the millennial reign. So which ’second coming’ is Paul refering to?
Well notice how he phrases what will happen on “that day”. He says, “and by our gathering together unto him“. This seems to imply the same event as the pre-trib rapture, does it not?
Ok, so we’ve established that this is definately speaking of the coming of Christ, and if the Bible speaks of a pre-trib rapture, then that is what Paul is speaking about here. Or is it?
You see, in v3 it tells us that two things will happen BEFORE this second coming:
- i) The great apostasy, “there come a falling away first…”
- ii) The revealing of the antichrist, “and that man of sin be revealed…”
Now I’m not going to get sidetracked into defending the fact that there will be a revealing of the Antichrist who will rule for seven years (the first half will be years of peace and prosperity, the second half bringing great deception and persecution for those who will not follow him), most Bible-believing Christian’s are united on this point. The point of debate, is whether Christians living prior to these seven years, will be removed just before they commence.
This is where we get into problems, and 2 Thes 2:3 does not tally with this per-trib rapture idea. You see, Paul is telling us clearly that the coming of Christ will not come until (or before) the Antichrist is revealed! No matter what way you twist and turn it, that is what the verse is saying very clearly.
Therefore, because the Antichrist is revealed during the Tribulation, how can the coming of Christ be before the Tribulation when it is clearly telling us that it will not happen until the Antichrist is revealed?
Can you see it? I hope I have made it clear. Please don’t take this as a personal attack against my pre-tribulation rapture believing brethren, it is not intended to be so.
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Added Commentary
By Everyday Weekender
on 18.03.07
I love that pic.. you should have a caption contest for what that kid says:
“you’re breath smells like glue”
“are those really you’re ears”
By Everyday Weekender
on 18.03.07
ohh one more:
“daddy your so silly”
By Louise Norman
on 18.03.07
I know of at least two internet articles that pre-trib rapturists don’t want anyone to see: “Famous Rapture Watchers” and “Pretrib Rapture Diehards.” Check em out and you will see what I mean. Lou
By Armen
on 18.03.07
EW - Welcome! Yeah, that would have been an idea, only I got that photo as it is off another site.
Louise - Welcome to you too! Thanks for letting us know, I’ll check them out later.
I have got a more comprehensive article than this, but I thought I’d just deal with it in a very plain and simple way that is easy to digest.
By Everyday Weekender
on 19.03.07
Thanks Armen.. I really enjoyed your site, so I’m going to visit often!
By Tony Foeller
on 20.03.07
Hey Armen,
I’m with you on the pre-trib rapture thing.
I DO believe that the church will be “taken up”, but I just can’t justify biblically that it will happen BEFORE the tribulation. There are cases to be made for a mid-trib and post-trib assumption of the church, however.
By Melanie
on 20.03.07
Yes understand this fully Armen, well explained!
By Armen
on 21.03.07
EW - Thanks for the encouragement! I appreciate it.
Tony - Yeah, I’m not one for debating end-time views for the most part, but the pre-trib rapture notion is so clearly unbiblical, that it ought to be exposed with all due respect to the brethren that hold to it.
Melanie - Hopefully everyone else thinks the same.
By a.k.
on 22.03.07
rapture - unbiblical…hey, i think you are on to something!!!
By Armen
on 23.03.07
A.K. - Sadly, not everyone see’s it that way so clearly.
By chas carter
on 07.04.07
Has anyone considered the fact that because there are at least three views of the rapture, pre, mid, post, there can be only one right view. Since this is true, and since we are (whether right or wrong) willing to acknowledge the possibility of any, what if the pre-trib rapture theory, and I do consider it a theory, is wrong. What happens to the faith of those who find themselves in the midst of severe trials after living in ‘certainty’ that God would take them out prior to it???????
By Armen
on 07.04.07
Welcome Chris!
You raise an interesting point. Think of the dangers that believing Christ will come before the anti-christ is revealed may bring. It may mean the danger of those that believe such, convincing themselves that they’re not living in the Tribulation period, when in fact they are. That brings the awful danger that they might receive ‘the mark’, a terrible thought indeed.
We have the comfort though, that those who are truly converted, shall not be deceived. “If it were possible, he should deceive the very elect.” Thankfully, it’s not possible.
By pilgrim
on 29.05.07
Dispensationalists’ have never espoused the revealing of the lawless one with the beginning of the Day of the Lord. I believe some are misunderstanding some of the specifics that are germane to Dispensationalism. The above is not germane.
What starts Daniel’s 70th seven (which is what many call the Tribulation) is the signing of a covenant with commonwealth Israel (Dan. 9:27). This begins the 7 years of wrath. The revealing of the lawless one does not, and neither does the rapture begin the Day of the Lord.
Another issue to consider is the Greek manuscripts. Some say the Day of Christ (η ημεÏα του χÏιστου), some say the Day of the Lord (η ημεÏα του κυÏιου). The Day of the Lord is a common term used in the Old Testament relating to God’s wrath on the earth, especially in refining judgment of Israel. Never is the term Day of Christ used. If it were used in the Hebrew Scriptures, it would be the day of Mashiach, for Christós and MashÃach both mean the “Messiah” or “the Anointed One”. Perhaps the two are interchangable, perhaps they are not. If not, then which was Paul originally speaking of?
Also one must consider the context of the passage. Obviously the congregation at ThessalonÃki were deceived into thinking that the Day of the Lord HAD begun. Paul stresses that it cannot be so, because the lawless one had not yet appeared on the scene. This fits logically with the 70th Seven of Daniel, for if the confirming of a covenant with Israel begins the Seven, then logically the one issuing the covennant, the lawless one, must be revealed and present. Paul then goes into detail about what the lawless one will do. He descibes what the lawless one will accomplish from his revealing to his destruction. The greek term for day can mean “day” or “period” or “age” or “years”. No where is the resurrection and catching up of the saints even metioned in this passage.
The rapture is imminent. Why? Paul includes himself as being part of the generation of those who are still alive (1 Thess. 4) and who are caught up to meet the Lord in the air. Imminent means that it can happen at anytime. If it happened tonight, the tribulation could still not begin for another 40 years. Or the rapture could happen after the very day the lawless one is revealed. Paul never says the day of Christ or the Lord is the rapture. What we know for sure , which begins the 7 years of wrath, is the covenant that the Prince to come makes with the commonwealth of Israel, not the rapture nor the Prince’s revealing, but his covenant with Israel.
What those who don’t believe in the mystery of the rapture must do is explain why the church of Philadelphia is promised to be kept from the trial that is coming on all who dwell on the whole earth.
I’m sorry, but this verse does not destroy “the pre-trib rapture”.
Grace and peace.
By Armen
on 04.06.07
Pilgrim - I’ve written further on my views of the rapture, if you’d like to read it.
However, I’m very intrigued as to how you assume Rev 3:10 is speaking of the great tribulation period (assuming that is what you mean)?
By miko
on 24.10.07
That’s great!! In Matthew 24 in parallel with Revelation 6 it simply tells us the proper sequence of the events of Christ’s second coming..
1st seal- appearance of false messiah ( Rev 6:1-2; Matt 24:5)
2nd seal- wars ( Rev 6:3-4; Matt 24:6)
3rd seal- famine (Rev 6:5-6; Matt 24:7)
And in Matt 24:8 Jesus said that those are just the begining of sorrows.
At this point, I believe antichrist will rise and rule for forty-two months or the second half of the seven year period…
This could be the abomination of desolation, Daniel { not Daniel but Gabriel} has something to say at this point, in the middle of Daniel’s 70th week.
Daniel 9:27 he {the antichrist} will confirm a covenant with many for one week. But in the MIDDLE of that WEEK
he will bring sacrifices and offerings to a halt.
On the wing of abominations will come one who destroys,
until the decreed end is poured out on the one who destroys.â€
4th seal- Death, The great tribulation of antichrist ( Rev 6:7-8; Matt 24: 9)
5th seal- Cry of those martyred by Satan’s wrath ( Rev 6: 9-11; Matt 24: 10-12)
6th seal- The signs that initiate the day of the Lord ( Rev 6: 12-14; Matt 24;29)
Now, how are we to know that the 6th seal initiates the day of the Lord? Joel has something to say.
Joel 3:14 Crowds, great crowds are in the valley of decision, for the day of the Lord is near in the valley of decision!
3:15 The sun and moon are darkened;
the stars withhold their brightness.
3:16 The Lord roars from Zion;
from Jerusalem his voice bellows out.
The heavens and the earth shake.
But the Lord is a refuge for his people;
he is a stronghold for the citizens of Israel.
The Lord’s Presence in Zion.
The rapture must be after Rev. 6 and before the opening of the seventh seal in Rev. 8 which is the wrath of God.
I strongly believe Revelation 7:9 is the Raptured Church or the elect .
Revelation 7:9 After these things I looked, and here was an enormous crowd that no one could count, made up of persons from every nation, tribe, people, and language, standing before the throne and before the Lamb dressed in long white robes, and with palm branches in their hands.
In addition with this verse,
Revelation 7:13 Then one of the elders asked me, “These dressed in long white robes – who are they and where have they come from?â€
7:14 So I said to him, “My lord, you know the answer.†Then he said to me, “These are the ones who have come out of the great tribulation. They have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb!
We see now that it harmonizes with the promise of God that He will deliver His elect [ church ] before He pours out His wrath.
( 1 Thess. 1:10 and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus our deliverer from the coming wrath.
2 Thess. 2:3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not arrive until the rebellion comes and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction.)
miko
By john
on 30.10.07
In response to the ‘one verse destroys’ commentary, you are certainly correct that the day of the Lord will not come until all the things in 1 Thes 2 take place. However you make one mistake. In the following, “2 Thessalonians 2
1Now we request you, brethren, with regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him,” Paul is actually talking about two separate events, ‘the coming of our Lord’ and ‘our gathering together to Him’ are not the same event but separate events. Let me explain. The people Paul is writing to have been told that ‘the day of the Lord’ has come. They are worried because if that is the case then they believe they have missed the ‘rapture’ which preceeds the day of the Lord. Paul has obviously told them about the rapture and they are understandably worried because they are still here. Paul is trying to ease their minds by telling them all the things that must happen before the ‘day of the Lord’ or Christ’s return. He is proving to them that the ‘day of the Lord’ has not come, therefore, the rapture hasn’t happened either. In Christ … John
By Jermayn Parker
on 21.12.07
Coming in real late I know:
I believe in a pre-rapture, I dont know why but i do, I dont have any ‘real’ biblical facts, I just do…
lol
I however am no scholar in this area and since I found out that it was the Calvinists who first started this ‘belief’ I have doubted it but have not studied it more…
By Armen
on 22.12.07
Jermayn - Sorry, I didn’t see you had commented here.
Well, it’s a worthy study, but not crtical. However, I wouldn’t doubt it just because it may have it’s background in Calvinistic thought. I’m a ‘calvinist’, but I don’t believe the pre-trib rapture.
By Jermayn Parker
on 23.12.07
@Armen - I just commented, its ok buddy! I hope I dont offend you but…
My problem with the Calvinistic thoughts is that if God ‘chooses’ who gets saved or not, why bother witnessing to people??
By Rusty
on 25.12.07
The problem is that 2 Thes 2 is talking about two separate events … 1: our gathering together to Him 2: the day of the Lord. The Thessolonians were worried that they had missed event 1 because people had told them that event 2 had happened. Paul explains that event 2 hadnt’ happened, therefore they hadn’t missed event 1. There aren’t two separate comings of the Lord. The rapture isn’t a coming at all, but a gathering of the saints into the clouds because they simply aren’t needed during the Tribulation.
By Paul Chastain
on 06.06.08
You might have some interest in my Blog…
By John Shoop
on 06.06.08
I have submitted the following before and would love a response from Armen… God Bless… In response to the ‘one verse destroys’ commentary, you are certainly correct that the day of the Lord will not come until all the things in 1 Thes 2 take place. However you make one mistake. In the following, “2 Thessalonians 2
1Now we request you, brethren, with regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him,” Paul is actually talking about two separate events, ‘the coming of our Lord’ and ‘our gathering together to Him’ are not the same event but separate events. Let me explain. The people Paul is writing to have been told that ‘the day of the Lord’ has come. They are worried because if that is the case then they believe they have missed the ‘rapture’ which preceeds the day of the Lord. Paul has obviously told them about the rapture and they are understandably worried because they are still here. Paul is trying to ease their minds by telling them all the things that must happen before the ‘day of the Lord’ or Christ’s return. He is proving to them that the ‘day of the Lord’ has not come, therefore, the rapture hasn’t happened either. In Christ … John
By Armen
on 12.06.08
John,
The reason I never responded is simply because I don’t find three ‘comings’ of our Lord in the scriptures. No matter what you argue, any pre-tribulation ‘rapture’ necessitates three events, when it is explicit that there are only two;
i) His first coming, as the virgin born Son of God, to procure salvation for His people
ii) His return to consummate the redemption of His people.
You’re explanation of the passage you refer to, does not tally with the rest of scripture.
By Michael
on 14.09.08
II Thess. 2 doesn’t speak about two separate events. It is talking about one event. Verse 1 shows us it one event. Here is verse 1:
Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
The word “and” is very important. It is a conjuntive used to join two things, actions or people together. In addition, “and” is also used to connect two things in a temporal sense.
Our Lord Jesus Christ is coming again and when he comes the first thing he will do is “gather his elect unto him”.
Also, if they are separate event then why does the “Day of The Lord” precede our gathering unto him. For God did not appoint us to wrath but unto salvation (I Thess 5:9).
Finally, more proof that we are talking about one event can be found in the parable of wheat and the tares. What is the first thing he is going to do on the day of the Lord? He is going to gather the wheat and store it in his barn, then he is going to bind the tares and utterly burn them.
By DEL
on 25.09.08
As one who has studied and taught Bible prophecy for 40 years, comment no. 13 by “Pilgrim” is correct.
Respectfully yours.
By Armen
on 25.09.08
DEL,
With all due respect, teaching Bible prophecy for 40 years doesn’t mean you know more than the next person. The Pre-Trib Rapture is the fruit of not understanding the Bible as one harmonious unit.
The commenter Michael (#24) is correct. The coming of Christ and our gathering to Him are the same event. If not, the events are back-to-front. You should read this post.
By Bro Miller
on 10.10.08
The most taught and believed doctrine in Church`s today is that all the saved alive at the return of Christ at the first resurrection,will escape the coming great tribulation which is called the pre Tribulation Rapture.
They base this on since from chapter 4 of Revelation on the Church is not mentioned so therefore is not in the great tribulation.I was reading Revelation chapter 20:4-5 in the Authorized Version.
And I saw thrones,and they sat upon them,and judgment was given unto them,and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus,and for the word of God,and which had not worshipped the beast,neither his image,neither had received his mark upon their foreheads,or in their hands,and they lived with Christ a thousand years.
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished,This is the first resurrection.
How can a pre-tribulation rapture at the first resurrection be before the great tribulation when verse 5 of Revelation clarifies the ones refusing to worship the beast and refusing the mark of the beast that were killed in the great tribulation are in the first resurrection also?
A Pre-Tribulation 1st Resurrection Rapture is clearly unbiblical.It clearly is post Trib.
By Armen
on 13.10.08
Welcome Bro Miller,
Thanks for your thoughts.
Like you, I find difficulty in comprehending how one can believe in this. I suppose it just depends on where your influences come from.
The Church will be here until the final return of Christ. Like you say, it is clearly post Trib.
By Jaybird632
on 27.04.09
Old Blog Post….
“A Pre-Tribulation 1st Resurrection Rapture is clearly unbiblical.It clearly is post Trib.”
The literal meaning of the word rapture means “caught up”. In 1st Thessalonians 4:17.
This topic is not clear in anyway other than that Christ’s coming is soon….
However, my position is PreTrib…
By johnny elliott
on 03.10.09
i totally agree with you. i have written nearly a 400 page book which is in the process of being typed and hopefully find a publisher with litlle funds. i have one more chapter to write which entails the history of the doctrine of the pre-trib rapture theory. i used only biblical scriptures as proof there will be no pretrib rapture and not any opinions of my own i hope. i hope to have it complete by early next year and ready for publishing, maybe you can give me some suggestions. love in christ, johnny.
By Scott
on 31.01.10
Well, the argument that the flesh buys into a pre tribulation is not wisdom from above. Some how we have to “save” people from the enormous upset of going through the trib by disproving any other way is, well, interestingly enough plain wrong. Most of the church will have already died without going through “the tribulation”. Every post tribber (not saying all, just everyone I have known) tribulates amost to the point of destruction in our current world. Let me say to really live as a true spirit filled/ walking in the Spirit christian, YOU WILL have tribulation now that is extremely challenging. Many are falling away now because to the extreme contrast. So many thing the wrath in the tribulation is the devils. You really believe the wrath in the great tribulation is not from God?
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